New Road Deputy Chairman of Yeni Yol Group consisting of Gelecek, DEVA and Felicity Party, which established a group in the Parliament under the name of Yeni Yol, 24th, 25th, 26th, Manisa, 28th term, Muğla MP Selcuk Ozdag’I interviewed him in his office at the Parliament.
I asked a lot of questions about Turkey's main agenda, and Mr. Selçuk answered my questions sincerely and gave me many headlines. Of course, it cannot be said that I agree or disagree with all his views, my duty is to ask questions on behalf of the public and leave the appreciation of comments to the public.
“These cases are political...”
What do you think about the IBB Indictment that has occupied the agenda in recent days?
“It is wrong to say that there is massive corruption here, it is wrong to say that there is no corruption of any blind penny here. There are doubts about the way this case was opened, some say political, some say legal. I see the purpose of the opening as political.
Why? There are inspection boards of the Ministry of Interior, Imamoğlu had previously activated the inspection boards during Kadir Topbaş's term, Süleyman Soylu said you can't activate them and took them away.
They did not want to expose the corruption, the theft, the arbitrariness here. This is a double standard. This is not protecting our state, this is not protecting the public, this is even protecting those who have been skimming public property.
And what happened to those files? We don't know! Mansur Yavaş transferred nearly a hundred files to the prosecutor's office. Did the President, the AK Party Chairman, the heads of the People's Alliance show sensitivity about these files? They did not!
Did they show it on February 17th? They didn't! Did they show the same sensitivity to the Minister who bought disinfectant for her husband? They didn't.
Were some MPs, ministers, advisors, general managers shown? No. Not those who have ties with the government. The assets of all bureaucrats should be investigated. That's why I see this case as political.
Imamoglu and other mayors can be tried without arrest. They were inspected 1039 times by the Court of Accounts and inspection boards on various dates. If it was applied equally to all municipalities in Turkey, I would say yes.
During the Covid era, municipalities that helped were not allowed to do so, they were told, "Are you building a state within the state?" but their own municipalities were given loans from banks. Municipalities were shown either a carrot or a stick.
The indictments in 1971, the indictments in 1980... I was indicted, I was imprisoned for 7.5 years, and then most of my friends were acquitted.
We saw these indictments in 1980, everyone was tried with death penalty, but after ten years everyone was acquitted. I was acquitted after 7.5 years, who will do me justice?
What will they say when Imamoğlu is acquitted tomorrow, will they say pardon? What would have happened if he had been tried without arrest?
This was political engineering, the aim was to humiliate the Republican People's Party candidates in the eyes of the public. Erdoğan wants to win again, then he has a rival, there are two candidates that the CHP will nominate, one is Ekrem İmamoğlu, already nominated by the CHP, and one is Mansur Yavaş, who is currently receiving very high votes.
The judiciary will decide whether there is corruption or not. The presumption of innocence was not respected.
The prosecutor's statement that this is the corruption case of the century is not correct. You can't make an omission. You will say ‘I have prepared my indictment, I have put it there, the decision is for the court’.
There is a government that does not comply with the rulings of the Constitutional Court and the ECHR and pressures the judiciary from time to time. Akkoyun karakoyun will be clear from now on.”
“CHP should stop messing with Kılıçdaroğlu”
What do you think about the lawsuits filed and the verdicts issued in the CHP's congress case? Also, what do you think about the allegations that journalist Tamar Tanrıyar has been claiming for the last two months that CHP Leader Özgür Özel received 20 million dollars in exchange for making Antalya Metropolitan Mayor Muhyettin Böcek a candidate and that İmamoğlu received 12 million dollars?
“This happens in all parties, it is not a matter of morality, it is not a matter of law. Legal regulations can be made about this. This is not bribery, it happens in all parties. It happens in all elections. I have seen this in my thirty years of political life, but I didn't do it.
Kılıçdaroğlu formed a six-party table and took very important municipalities from the Ak Parti. It was a great success. The table of six received 48.5 percent of the votes. This is a great success.
For this reason, Republican People's Party members should stop dealing with Mr. Kemal, deal with whoever caused them these troubles, and return to the agenda of the country. I invite them to return to their legal and political struggle.
They should supervise their municipalities and not try to do what others do. They should also realize that the government stands over them like a lens and a telescope. They should split their hairs and act accordingly.”
Claims of $20 million and $12 million
“If there was such a thing, Manisa Chief Public Prosecutor and Istanbul Chief Public Prosecutor Akın Gürlek would have taken the necessary action by now.
It is also interesting that no lawsuit has been filed until today. If there was such a thing, the government would not forgive it and would do what was necessary, even gossip is considered a material for the government. But when it is about them, they try to forget it, for example, there is an allegation of corruption of 300 million in the Yunus Emre Foundation, still nothing...”
“Kandil made Erdogan's propaganda”
Özgür Özel has recently invited Erdoğan to compete in the ballot box, at one point announcing his candidacy for the presidency. Will you, as the opposition, support Özel if he becomes a candidate?
“Erdoğan did not want Imamoğlu to be a candidate. Because he had the capacity and potential to get votes from his own neighborhood. He was from Trabzon, he read the Koran, he defeated Erdoğan's candidates' party three times in Istanbul.
I believe that Mr. Kılıçdaroğlu has achieved a great success with the table of six. On the one hand, every day Kandil made Erdoğan propaganda by saying “Erdoğan is a fascist, Erdoğan is a dictator, Erdoğan is a murderer”. On the other hand, the West did not want the government to change because of the immigration policies.
At that time, Mr. Bahçeli supported Kılıçdaroğlu's candidacy.
I went on TV, not because I opposed Kılıçdaroğlu, but because I said, “Erdoğan and Bahçeli should not determine our candidate.”.
Now Erdoğan and Bahçeli should not determine the Presidential candidate of the opposition. It looks like there will be a multi-candidate candidate in the first round, someone who will make it to the second round should not be a candidate that Erdoğan and Bahçeli like. They don't want someone who can get votes in Erdoğan and Bahçeli's neighborhood.
I repeat, Erdoğan and Bahçeli should not nominate our candidate.
“After Erdoğan, Bilal Erdoğan is the Presidential Candidate.”
The coming election will be an election of supreme importance.
If Erdoğan wins, he will stay for seven years, and after seven years he will nominate his own son, and no other candidate has a chance. Soylu was aspiring, Mr. Davutoğlu was aspiring, they didn't let him go. Now there are those who aspire for the presidency again, Numan Kurtulmuş, Mr. Hakan (Fidan), they shouldn't aspire either, here Erdoğan chooses the candidate and chooses his son. They are preparing Bilal Erdoğan.
I think Özgür Özel is young, he should prepare for the prime ministership of the parliamentary system during the transition period... Still, it is up to him.”
Will you support us?
“Will we nominate a candidate, how will we proceed? We will look at that. Three parties, Gelecek, Deva Saadet are acting together. We have elbow contact with Refah. We are talking to the Democratic Party. We have elbow contact with the Good Party. Let there be a multiple parliament.
Today the MHP governs the country with 50 deputies. The Ak Parti has the majority, but all laws are made with 301 votes. Personally, I am in favor of alliances with conservative parties. From time to time we talk with fellow DEM MPs about Turkey without terrorism.”
“Don't operate on Turkey, brother...”
What do you think about the ongoing peace process and the so-called “Terror Free Turkey”?
“Who does not want a Turkey without terrorism... Terrorism is not only a phenomenon in which weapons are taken. It is also the terrorist activity of those who do not build a social state. It is also the terrorist activity of those who fail to ensure justice in income distribution, it is also the terrorist activity of those who do not read history, geography and sociology.
Then we must first eliminate corruption, nepotism and lack of merit in Turkey, we must build the rule of law and justice, and then we can fight against those who take up arms. Then there will be very few people who pick up guns.
When this does not happen, sovereign powers want to operate on Turkey. You build such a Turkey that no one will believe what those who go up to the mountains say. Turkey must have a good system and this system must appeal to all its employees.
The problem lies in universal rules of law, universal rules of morality. Turkey will be a state of law, Turkey will be audited, and those who audit Turkey will be held accountable.”
“Turkey without terrorism cannot be built in Turkey without law!”
What do you, as the Future Party, think about the Kurds living in the Middle East?
“Turkey without terrorism cannot be built in Turkey without law.
Even if it does, it is superficial, like a straw flame. We need to build an executive and legislature that abide by the ECHR laws and a Turkey that can be audited, a Turkey that can be held accountable.
We support a terror-free Turkey, but while we support this, we want to know what Abdullah Öcalan knows, we want to know what MIT knows, we want to know what Erdoğan and Bahçeli know. This should not be a party or government policy, this should be a state policy. They asked for our support and we gave it, they asked for members of the commission and we gave them members, but they shouldn't make this a domestic political issue. They should not make it a part of politics, an argument.”
“We want to know what Öcalan knows”
Is there something being hidden from you?
“Yes, there are some things they are hiding from us... We will see them in time, we put an option on the table with the condition of getting up while sitting at the table.
There are sovereign powers behind all terrorist organizations. This is certain. There are those in the organization who know this, and there are those who do not. Those who know act as if they do not know and continue to carry out actions. The Turkey Without Terror program must end as soon as possible and Turkey must return to its own issues.
Kurds have the same rights as the Arabs and Turkmens in Iran, Iraq and Syria. We say democratic Iran, democratic Syria, democratic Iraq, democratic Turkey. The Kurds there are our historical, cultural and religious compatriots. Turkey must negotiate with all its neighbors.”
Do you think a Truth Commission should be established?
“According to what are we going to establish a truth commission?
Terrorist organizations say I have already done these things.
Those who commit crimes within the state, those who violate gross human rights, those who sell drugs, etc. are already being prosecuted, families are suing.
The mother of an MP from Tunceli said to her son;
“The state has made mistakes in the past, so have the rebels. Leave the past in the past, the wounds will heal, my son.”
These incidents happened in the past in the UK, but they are no longer talked about. I'm not saying we shouldn't investigate, I'm saying the rule of law should investigate everything, I'm against whoever has put themselves in the state, whoever has done something by violating the law, if the existing law knows that they have done something and doesn't do anything about it, I'm against them.
When we establish a truth commission, there are executions carried out by the PKK, what are we going to do about them?
Are we going to retry these guys again? These are not realistic statements.
This is not a matter of Turks and Kurds, Kurds can live freely all over Turkey. There is nothing that a Turk has that a Kurd does not have, except the mother tongue...
This problem is between the state, the state's law enforcement forces and the PKK. Those who are not involved in a crime will come and surrender. I see that there will be a legal arrangement regarding them.
Those involved in the incident can go to third world countries, there are also those who are associated, the regulation to be made regarding them should also be for those who are associated with other organizations, it should cover them.”
“When we heal one wound, we must also heal other wounds”
What I understand from Mehmet Uçum's statement is that a partial amnesty is coming for the organization. A partial amnesty?
“It is not a partial amnesty, but a legal arrangement is coming. There will be an arrangement with those who are involved in crimes, those who are not involved in crimes and those who are related.”
If there will be a legal regulation for the PKK, will this regulation also include those with emergency decrees?
“The law is not applied differently to this person, differently to that person, differently to those in power, differently to those in opposition. It cannot be applied differently to Kurds, Turkmens, Alevis and Sunnis, the law must be applied equally to everyone.
As we heal one wound, we must also heal other wounds.
If you leave the law alone, the law will make the right decisions. No to arbitrariness, no to double standards...
The state should embrace all its citizens. We lost a lot of our people. We lost a lot in the First World War, we lost 135 thousand people in the War of Independence, some say we lost 50 thousand, some say 60 thousand, we lost in 1960, we lost in 1971, we lost in 1980.
We lost many children of the community to FETÖ, we lost our children in the fight against the PKK, we lost nearly fifty thousand people.
The families of these people became criminals, criminals, the personal principle of crimes was abolished, they could not become anything (they could not enter the public sector), they went abroad. We should not lose our people, we should gain our people.
Justice is the religion of states...
I was the Vice Chairman of the July 15th Coup Investigation Commission and I sent a letter to Mr. President. I sent a letter to the President.
“I am calling out from here in the language of Islam, justice, justice, justice...”
“I said even Bylock is not evidence”
What do you say to the criticism that the Future Party does not sufficiently protect those who have been subjected to emergency decrees??
“This is so wrong! So unfair!
When Ahmet Davutoğlu founded his party, he organized a special workshop on the people with emergency decree laws, Ali Babacan organized a special workshop. Ali Babacan's party and Ahmet Davutoğlu's party were the most talked about.
We talked the most in parliament, how many proposals we gave, how many research proposals we gave...They should follow us well and not be unfair. I spoke out against putting the dry and the wet in the same bag.
I am someone who wrote a letter to the President, no one can write that.
I wrote, ‘Even Bylock is not evidence’.
‘I said, ’If a man walks around with a wine bottle, don't treat him as drunk, treat him according to the content,‘ I said, ’look at what this man has done,” I said, 'if he participated in the coup, fine..."
Did you write a letter to the President when you were the Deputy Chairman of the Coup Investigation Commission?
“Yes, I wrote a letter. Let's not put the wet in the same bag with the dry. I said that our judiciary and our intelligence have the capacity to differentiate this, let it be differentiated.”
Did you get an answer?
“No, there was no answer, but I worked a lot on this issue. I met with Binali Yıldırım, I met with the upper echelons of the party, I held meetings. I spoke on TV, but I wrote long before that Fethullah Gülen would take over the state.”
“The biggest victimized groups in Turkey are Alevis and Roma”
What do you think about the Kurds in Syria, Iraq, Iran and Turkey, do you think there is a Kurdish problem? Bernard Lewis said: “In Turkey, there is a tacit agreement that if someone calls himself Kurdish, the state will not let him into the public sector.” What do you think about this observation?
“From time to time, some people may have looked at such incidents locally, but I believe that two groups are victimized the most in the Republic of Turkey.
One, I believe Roma people are very victimized. Two, I believe Alevis are victimized.
I believe that people from the Bektashi tradition were also victimized. Locally, Turkmens and Kurds were also victimized.
For example, I was suspended from my duty three times during the February 28th period, for example, I am Turkmen, I was not given my professorship. They didn't sign my professorship. And they still don't give it to me...
If you are close to the government, you can be anything, even if you are yesterday's Kurd, but if you are far from the government, you can be nothing, even if you are a thousand-year-old Kurd. If you are close to the government and you are Turkish, you can be anything, but if you are against the government, you can be nothing even if you are a thousand-year-old Turk. Today, you are not determined by ideologies, beliefs or ethnic structures, you are determined by whether you are close to the government or not. So I disagree with Bernard Lewis.”
For example, I was labeled during February 28, all the exams I won were ignored, and I was labeled while I was at TRT, I was fired, I was not appointed to TRT World, which I won, I filed a lawsuit and my case is at the ECHR. And this is documented and proven...
“Cüneyt Can! They were not only labeling those who called themselves Kurds, they were also labeling those who called themselves countrymen...Look, I teach at a school, I am a history major. The principal of the school where I was working told me that a new teacher from MIT had come here and they said he was an enemy of the Republic, so they had labeled me as an enemy of the Republic...-I am a person who loves the Republic, we established this Republic under very difficult conditions.
Democrat Party members labeled CHP members. Leftist youth were labeled in this country.
A young girl came from Manisa. She got a 95 in the judge's exam, but they eliminated her.
I know the family, a Democratic Party family, I know them very well. The girl says, I have nothing to do with this organization. I called Justice, Interior and MIT. We found out that in Istanbul, they said, ‘302 people died in Soma, we will organize a ceremony for the students. She's from Manisa. She's joining in. The police are filming with their lapel cameras. They take a video of this too. This was organized by an illegal organization, children don't know that they are an illegal organization. The police and intelligence know about them, the children don't...
Everyone there is flagged by intelligence. They don't make her a judge because her picture appeared there. But today, there is not a single person who says, ”I took the interview and was not accepted because I am Kurdish..."
“The real terrorist is the one who takes bribes, extorts money, shows favoritism”
I'm in, Mr. Representative, with documents...
“I say these are local, nearly 70 members of parliament say they are Kurdish, and there are others who cannot. The Ak Parti has made very serious reforms regarding the mother tongue. The PKK terrorist organization should lay down its arms. Let's teach both Turkish and Kurdish in primary schools, nothing will happen....
Are you saying it can be the second official language?
“Let it be the language of education, not the official language. The official language is Turkish. Don't misunderstand, sometimes DEM deputies call Kurdistan, they say we use it geographically, they call it a Kurdish city. These are wrong. These are not the right things, don't Arabs and Turks live in Diyarbakır?
Everyone lives everywhere. When we look at the history of this region, there were neither Kurds nor Turkmens before. There were Greeks and Armenians here. Then Arabs came. We need to look at them as human beings.
Human rights are individual, not collective. Turkey does not have a Kurdish problem, Turkey has a human rights problem, a rule of law problem. Turkey has a problem of lack of oversight.
The real terrorist is the one who takes bribes, extorts money, shows favoritism. The real terrorist is the one who discriminates in Turkey. The real terrorist is the one who does not do his duty, if they had done their duty, would there be so many terrorist activities in Turkey? There would not have been so much bloodshed, so many tears, so much suffering...”
Atatürk said, ‘Burn the photograph of Seyit Riza at the moment of his hanging.
When Seyit Rıza was hanged, Mustafa Kemal was on his way to Elazığ. About 600 people wearing white underwear from Dersim started to march towards Elazığ.
They are marching for Seyit Riza. Let's see what Mustafa Kemal has to say.
Before Mustafa Kemal arrives in Elazığ, Seyit Rıza is hanged. They show Mustafa Kemal a negative picture of Seyit Reza at the moment of his hanging.
Mustafa Kemal is brought to the unit and he asks for his picture. They tell him, ‘Oh, sir, there is only one picture of him’.
Mustafa Kemal says it is still close.
‘This will turn into a blood feud,’ he says. These are not the right things, it is not right to advertise them.
We need to do the right things, Turkey needs to meet democracy again. It needs to evolve from the state of my person to the state of my nation.”
“The political establishment should take its hands off the judiciary”
Selahattin Demirtas?
“The ECHR has made a decision about Demirtaş. Mr. Bahçeli comes out and says ‘Demirtaş should be released’. I find this wrong. The political institution should take its hands off the judiciary and implement what the judiciary says.
The judiciary says the decisions of the Constitutional Court are binding. He has already been in prison for nine years, the equivalent of nine years is about thirty years... These are not the right things. People from our party also visited Demirtaş. Turkey must speak. The people the government wants are released, the people the government doesn't want are not released. The ECHR decision is there, Selahattin Demirtaş must be released.”
“There is no deep state in Turkey, there is a deep America”
Was the death of Muhsin Yazıcıoğlu an accident, a murder or an assassination? Is there a deep state?
Muhsin Yazıcıoğlu was murdered. Muhsin Yazıcıoğlu was killed for these days.
“There is no deep state in Turkey. In Turkey there is deep America, there are deep sovereign powers. There are deep gangs, their extensions. There are deep statists who think that they are the state. F-16s flew over Muhsin Yazıcıoğlu's helicopter, this is fixed. It is visible on Sivas radars, but their nationality is not clear.
Maraş radars show a malfunction. I testified at the time. We asked for the Incirlik base's compliance, but the Incirlik base did not provide it. The helicopter was deranged because of the F-16s.
It wasn't an impact. It is a fall
When they saw that the journalist on board was alive, the extensions in Turkey thought that Muhsin Yazıcıoğlu might be alive, that if he survived his injuries he might be a hero, that we could cause trouble, and they found him three days later. Yet they knew where the helicopter was half an hour after the crash. They did not intervene, they waited, they distorted, the extensions of the rulers...For example, the Fethullah Gülen movement is a CIA movement. At first it was not, later it became a CIA movement.”
Are you sure that the Fethullah Gülen Movement is a CIA movement?
“Of course...
Close to a million sympathizers of this movement have worked all over the world.
Intelligence was shared with them and Fethullah Gülen shared it with the CIA. What are these smart children doing in Africa? They identify the smart kids and send the geniuses to America. It is a multifaceted CIA movement.
Are you sure, you ask...
Fethullah Gülen was accompanied by a state bodyguard when he left.
I was also the Group Chairman, I am now the Deputy Group Chairman. When I go abroad, I go without protection. I go unarmed, my country there is my weapon. But when Fethullah Gülen left, he was not a retired imam or a retired preacher, he was a retired laborer. They showed him as a proofreader in a printing house.
That was wrong too.
When he traveled abroad, he had an armed bodyguard provided by the state. Fethullah Gülen was given a green passport. He was not a Diyanet employee.
Who gave it to them and why?
Who met you when you left?
Fethullah Gülen was a man who wanted to take over the state since 1991. His coup attempt, the unauthorized wiretaps on 17/25 and the subsequent July 15 movement built the authoritarian structure we have today. All the blame belongs to Fethullah Gülen.
Muhsin Yazıcıoğlu was murdered. Muhsin Yazıcıoğlu was killed for these days.
I am telling you what Muhsin Yazıcıoğlu said to a member of parliament the night before he died, namely to Nevzat Yanmaz, before the morning prayer, Muhsin Bey said:
“Nevzat, don't leave me alone, I will return to Ankara, I will gather my friends. This Fethullah Gülen is doing evil to Turkey. They have been involved in some illegal incidents, I will both save my citizens from this and start a great struggle against Fethullah Gülen against the ruling powers.” He says.
In how many years, in 2009, the government is still flirting with them?.
I told those who came to me for mediation, those who said ‘mediate between Fethullah Gülen and Recep Tayyip Erdoğan’, I said ‘get out of here’.
Here I said I stand by Recep Tayyip Erdoğan. You can look at my television speeches. No one could have fought this struggle except Erdoğan.
But Erdoğan's mistake is that he did not raise his voice against putting the wet and the dry in the same bag after July 15. Erdoğan has a great responsibility for this,’ I said.
I would be glad if you write about this too, because my statement “Erdoğan has a great responsibility” has been used differently by other media outlets and various circles. Someone abroad is exploiting this statement.
And this coup was carried out by Fethullah Gülen and his friends. Others were also involved in this coup.
The biggest mistake of the state, the government, was to lose its citizens, to throw them out of the public sector, it could have not thrown them out, it could have only taken them from important places, such as intelligence agencies. It should have won its citizens, it should have gained the trust of its citizens.
Both security officials and military officials who get ranks in Ankara and Istanbul, they also get the same officials by the hand of Fethullah Gülen. We have pictures of some of them.”
Can you explain this a little bit more, how does it work?
“They get ranks in Turkey, and they also get ranks from Fethullah Gülen. First the state gives them a rank here, then they go to Pennsylvania and this time Fethullah Gülen gives them a rank.
Secondly, one month before the coup, Fethullah Gülen's entire staff went abroad. In this situation, who is left here, the organization and the ordinary citizen?.
Putin's advisor arriving on Cavit Çağlar's plane and delivering a letter warning Erdoğan and the government about the coup...
“This is false information. That person was not Putin's advisor at that time, I was in charge of the coup commission at that time, we conducted a study on the man, the information reflected in the public opinion is not true. This person was not working with Putin at that time, he was once his advisor. He came and held meetings with a few people here and there.
It was already known that the coup was going to happen. In the open intelligence, the Fetöists were writing, ‘we will raid them in bed, we will catch them at dawn’. They were that reckless. So it is not true that Putin's advisor came and warned Erdoğan, this and that.
The government knew there was going to be a coup, but they didn't know when or how it would happen.
“Davutoğlu should not be Vice President”
What is the future of the Future Party? How do you evaluate Davutoğlu's statement ‘I can be Vice President’?
“The Future Party, Yeniden Refah, Yeni Yol, Saadet, Gelecek, Deva... Four parties, if necessary the Democrat Party, should form a bloc of democratic conservatives. On the one hand, they should form a bloc of democratic nationalists.
The Good Party and others...
They need to build a third road.
There is a need for checks and balances no matter who comes.
Mr. Davutoğlu should be here. I don't think it's right to do anything with the government. Why? Mr. Davutoğlu was the prime minister there. The Prime Ministry was very powerful. He knows what he went through with Mr. He knows what he went through with Mr. Erdoğan.
Today, it is not right to be Vice President at a time when the Presidency is in decline.
Erdoğan does not make anyone a partner in his affairs, and he eliminates those who covet his place. Therefore, what Mr. Davutoğlu needs to do is to build the third way. He is also successful in negotiations. He was also successful at the table of six. Of course, he also has shortcomings.
Your last word
“I appeal to the opposition:
The opposition should read Turkey correctly. Read the parliament correctly, read the demands of the nation correctly. The opposition should develop politics based on these correct readings. Don't let him run after the government. It should not follow the agenda of the government...
“The way to do this is true democracy, true rule of law. Real human rights. The way to this is a Turkey that can be audited and held accountable. Today Turkey is not governed transparently.
Today Turkey is being governed in a closed manner. This duty falls on all of us, otherwise we will all be under this stone. We will lose all our gains.”
***
Once again, I would like to express my gratitude to Mr. Özdağ for his valuable time and hospitality...
It was a fascinating and full interview, I couldn't bear to cut, crop and trim it because the information he gave was extremely important to me...